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Official CS Complaints procedure questions? - andyburnett - 10-02-2013

I have a few (a lot!) of questions...hopefully someone will have the time, knowledge and forebearance to answer them Smile

...If someone were to lodge an official complaint (let's say, for example, about decisions pertaining to a recent Richardson Cup match) who would deal with this within CS? The Standards Committee? An arbiters committee? Someone else?

-Would the complaint be made 'public' or would it be kept internal?
-Would the other team involved be told exactly what the complaint was even if the complaint wasn't specifically against them?
-Would the other team have to comply with any questions asked of them pertaining to the complaint if they weren't told what the complaint was?
-Would there be any way of annulling/reversing/or in some other way re-determining the result of the match in question if a decision was reached upholding the complaint?

-Does anyone have a copy of (last week's?) Scotland on Sunday column by Dougie Bryson? Apparently the column mentioned the match/complaint?!

Could Dougie or someone else post the text of it here perhaps (if I promise to be more religious about buying the paper in future! (I actually stopped buying it because every week I 'had' to read how great hunting/fishing/shooting is by some bloodsport enthusiast Sad

Any help or answers would be much appreciated,
Cheers,
Andy Burnett
(Wandering Dragons CC)


Re: Official CS Complaints procedure questions? - andyburnett - 11-02-2013

I now have a copy of the SOS column thanks to Dougie himself Smile Cheers.


Re: Official CS Complaints procedure questions? - amuir - 11-02-2013

Andy , Steve Hilton has resigned as Home Director, would you be interested in the job ?
You would then know what it's like to be an unpaid official. You can't please everyone


Re: Official CS Complaints procedure questions? - andyburnett - 11-02-2013

amuir Wrote:Andy , Steve Hilton has resigned as Home Director, would you be interested in the job ?
You would then know what it's like to be an unpaid official. You can't please everyone

When I find myself with more time to spare I'd gladly take on a role within CS, Andy.

In the meantime, as far as I am aware Steve resigned because certain people were unhappy with his decision (yourself and your team-mates perhaps?). Feel free to publish your complaint here if you like - open-ness and transparency are always welcomed =o and so far no-one else (DB aside) seems to have the time or interest in answering any of my questions.


Re: Official CS Complaints procedure questions? - Andy Howie - 11-02-2013

andyburnett Wrote:and so far no-one else (DB aside) seems to have the time or interest in answering any of my questions.

Bit harsh given I was out on Friday on a site visit from 5:30am to 11:30pm (with delayed flights) then leaving at 7:30 am on Sat to set up the Hamilton Congress where I was arbiting all weekend.

I presume I am allowed a little time to myself to recover before replying to posts on the noticeboard??


Re: Official CS Complaints procedure questions? - andyburnett - 11-02-2013

Andy Howie Wrote:
andyburnett Wrote:and so far no-one else (DB aside) seems to have the time or interest in answering any of my questions.

Bit harsh given I was out on Friday on a site visit from 5:30am to 11:30pm (with delayed flights) then leaving at 7:30 am on Sat to set up the Hamilton Congress where I was arbiting all weekend.

I presume I am allowed a little time to myself to recover before replying to posts on the noticeboard??

Sorry Andy, maybe I didn't make it clear - when I said "no-one seems to have the time..." I meant 'no-one seems to have the time, as of yet, because I know people are busy with other things (life etc!)' No offence or rebuke was intended =)


Re: Official CS Complaints procedure questions? - Andy Howie - 11-02-2013

andyburnett Wrote:I have a few (a lot!) of questions...hopefully someone will have the time, knowledge and forebearance to answer them Smile


...If someone were to lodge an official complaint (let's say, for example, about decisions pertaining to a recent Richardson Cup match) who would deal with this within CS? The Standards Committee? An arbiters committee? Someone else?

Depends on the nature of the complaint. Some go to Standards Committee, some to Arbiters Committee, some will be dealt with by the person running the tournament, some by the Directors and some by Hamish and I

Quote:-Would the complaint be made 'public' or would it be kept internal?

Again, it depends on the nature of the complaint. Not all complaints can be made public hence the Standards Committee (quite correctly) don't publish the minutes of their complaint deliberations.

Quote:-Would the other team involved be told exactly what the complaint was even if the complaint wasn't specifically against them?

Are we talking about a specific complaint or generally here. If the complaint is not against a team then why would they be told. Could be I am misunderstanding the question? I would imagine that in general the answer would be yes but I can see exceptions to this.

Quote:-Would the other team have to comply with any questions asked of them pertaining to the complaint if they weren't told what the complaint was?
I think it would be in the teams best interests to reply to questions pertaining to a complaint.

Quote:-Would there be any way of annulling/reversing/or in some other way re-determining the result of the match in question if a decision was reached upholding the complaint?

Hard to comment on without the specifics. Lets say that there is a match and it is discovered that there has been some cheating by using outside assistance as the French did one team tournament. Then yes there would be. Normally when a panel is set up, they will give the recommendations for what is to happen next.

Quote:-Does anyone have a copy of (last week's?) Scotland on Sunday column by Dougie Bryson? Apparently the column mentioned the match/complaint?!

Sorry I don't, depending on the date I was either out of the country or about to go out of the country. I hope this is what you were looking for


Re: Official CS Complaints procedure questions? - Andy Howie - 11-02-2013

andyburnett Wrote:
Andy Howie Wrote:
andyburnett Wrote:and so far no-one else (DB aside) seems to have the time or interest in answering any of my questions.

Bit harsh given I was out on Friday on a site visit from 5:30am to 11:30pm (with delayed flights) then leaving at 7:30 am on Sat to set up the Hamilton Congress where I was arbiting all weekend.

I presume I am allowed a little time to myself to recover before replying to posts on the noticeboard??

Sorry Andy, maybe I didn't make it clear - when I said "no-one seems to have the time..." I meant 'no-one seems to have the time, as of yet, because I know people are busy with other things (life etc!)' No offence or rebuke was intended =)

Thats cool Big Grin I am a bit on the tired side tonight so was probably sharper than I meant to be, Just about to head to bed. Definitely need an early night after the last two weeks!


Re: Official CS Complaints procedure questions? - andyburnett - 12-02-2013

Thanks Andy,
The only bit I have a problem with is the following...


Quote:-Would the other team have to comply with any questions asked of them pertaining to the complaint if they weren't told what the complaint was?


I think it would be in the teams best interests to reply to questions pertaining to a complaint.


If we don't know what the specific complaint is, then we can't properly decide what is in our best interests?!

I'm referring to the complaint allegedly raised by Hamilton regarding, probably, the board order problems we encountered in last month's Richardson Cup match.

As far as I am aware the complaint isn't against Dragons directly, but we are being asked to provide detailed information about our involvement in discussions prior to the match. I would have thought in this case that informing the club of the precise nature of the complaint -barring any legal problems - would be normal? (although I'm willing to be persuaded/educated otherwise).


Re: Official CS Complaints procedure questions? - Andy Howie - 12-02-2013

Now I know what this is about, as opposed to speaking generally

The Arbiters' Committee is in the preliminary stages of investigating a complaint. The first step in any such investigation is to establish exactly what happened. Surely it is in the best interests of chess and your club that the facts are known.

Unless your club has done something wrong then it should have nothing to fear in telling the truth.

If as a result of the fact finding process there would appear to be a case to answer then those involved are likely to be informed.

Those investigating are unlikely to answer your questions until the matter is resolved.