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Scottish Junior Chess (from their facebook page)
#11
Thanks to Mac and David, I think that is very unlikely for us (and for those two fine Gentlemen I am grateful!). Seriously Robin, have a chat with David Deary about this as he is one of the ones tackling this question. I am very interested in what they come up with, it is the reason the budget has TBC next to Junior Fees
"How sad to see, what used to be, a model of decorum and tranquility become like any other sport, a battleground for rival ideologies to slug it out with glee"
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#12
robin moore Wrote:Indeed. Would someone be kind enough to explain why ChessScotland's members subscriptions are being used to support a database system to grade SJC events for free, an organisation that is not affiliated to ChessScotland and is in fact openly hostile to them.

ChessScotland is not a charity. If we were a business we would be bankrupt if this was normal practice.
And who loses out of that? The kids.

There may be some hostility between some people within both CS and SJC, but if people get petty then the biggest losers are the kids.

Nobody benefits (IMHO) from SJC breaking away and creating their own grading. It is best to have one unified system and not have any further schisms within Scottish chess.
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#13
Derek Howie Wrote:
robin moore Wrote:Indeed. Would someone be kind enough to explain why ChessScotland's members subscriptions are being used to support a database system to grade SJC events for free, an organisation that is not affiliated to ChessScotland and is in fact openly hostile to them.

ChessScotland is not a charity. If we were a business we would be bankrupt if this was normal practice.
And who loses out of that? The kids.

There may be some hostility between some people within both CS and SJC, but if people get petty then the biggest losers are the kids.

Nobody benefits (IMHO) from SJC breaking away and creating their own grading. It is best to have one unified system and not have any further schisms within Scottish chess.

I fail to see why ChessScotland's members should continue to fund non-affiliated organisations.

The two main solutions appear to be...

1/ SJC (and any other non-affiliated organisations) create their own grading system.

2/ ChessScotland continue to grade games of non-affiliated organisations but charge a fee.
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#14
I think (and I am happy to be proven wrong) that NEJCA and LJC are the only junior organisations affiliated. What you are suggesting means that all primary schools leagues that are graded would have to pay unless that league affiliated. Any schools that grade would have to pay etc etc. Not sure I like this idea myself.

If you are serious, AGM is coming up. Get a seconder and propose it. That way the membership can decide
"How sad to see, what used to be, a model of decorum and tranquility become like any other sport, a battleground for rival ideologies to slug it out with glee"
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#15
Can we not allow primary school leagues to affiliate for a nominal and reduced affiliation fee?
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#16
Just had a quick scan through this years grading, that is a lot of affiliations. There are quite a few primary schools who get games graded as well. If we take the adult model, a club has to join CS, independent of the League. To have consistency in which Robin is suggesting you would need the juniors to do the same. I can't see too many schools doing that (see reduction in Megafinals for a perfect example of what happened there)

My fear is if we do this, we are going to kill off Schools chess. Schools chess is precarious enough as it is without throwing in an extra hurdle.
"How sad to see, what used to be, a model of decorum and tranquility become like any other sport, a battleground for rival ideologies to slug it out with glee"
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#17
robin moore Wrote:fail to see why ChessScotland's members should continue to fund non-affiliated organisations.

The two main solutions appear to be...

1/ SJC (and any other non-affiliated organisations) create their own grading system.

2/ ChessScotland continue to grade games of non-affiliated organisations but charge a fee.

And you were complaining last month about the Megafinal not being graded and now you're saying that you fail to see why it and similar tournaments should be graded by CS. A quick change of mind.

Your proposals would damage junior chess (including school chess, as Andy pointed out).

It would, of course, be possible to charge the kids extra for taking part in tournaments but do we really want to that given the way that attendances at junior events seem to be going? Surely we should be looking to do more to encourage junior chess, rather than putting up barriers?

Whatever happens, I firmly believe that schools chess should be excluded from any such proposals. There is not the ability or scope to collect funding for grading and it would end up that many chess games would be excluded from grading.
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#18
Andy,

I had a look at the CS graded events page regarding Primary school events. Lanarkshire schools seem to have the most number of games by far.

If Lanarkshire schools chess pay a fee to the organiser(s) would it be reasonable to suggest that Lanarkshire schools are perhaps under the false impression that part of that fee is used to grade their games?

Like everyone else, the last thing I wish to do is discourage children from playing chess from a young age.

Some options available to Lanarkshire schools (and similar) could be...

1/ Affiliate to ChessScotland and we will grade your games for free.

2/ Create your own grading system. (could be an interesting maths lesson!)

3/ Remain independent from ChessScotland but CS will be happy to grade your games for a fee.

4/ Enjoy playing chess as before but don't grade games.

Derek,

The Megafinal is graded by ChessScotland (at present for free I believe). If you look at the graded events page you will find that only one tournament organiser (SJC) has not as yet sent in their results.
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#19
Quote:If Lanarkshire schools chess pay a fee to the organiser(s) would it be reasonable to suggest that Lanarkshire schools are perhaps under the false impression that part of that fee is used to grade their games?

If they don't choose? The School I work with I do for nothing! I am with Derek, I would like to see Schools Chess exempt from this.
"How sad to see, what used to be, a model of decorum and tranquility become like any other sport, a battleground for rival ideologies to slug it out with glee"
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#20
robin moore Wrote:1/ Affiliate to ChessScotland and we will grade your games for free.

3/ Remain independent from ChessScotland but CS will be happy to grade your games for a fee.

Where does the money come from for either of these?

I also don't get CS's need for affiliation. What is served by that? Is it the affiliation fee? Is the extra cash that important that you're willing to jeopardise junior chess? If not, then what is the requirement?
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